I won’t be at the meeting tonight. You can put me down for a “no” vote on this one.
Ian B
Ian the vote isnt until 5/21
Dave V, last time I checked you shouldnt be dumping most chemicals down the drain. Acetone also says to not get it on you and has the same ventilation warnings thats on the MSDS I provided, but I dont think anyone would vote against having acetone in the shop.
Here is the MSDS for Acetone is anyone is curious, nearly worse on every front than the uncured resin for 405nm resin printers.
https://www.fishersci.com/shop/msdsproxy?productName=AC177170010&productDescription=ACETONE
Hi Daniel,
The difficulty with MSDS is that it only applies to the material in that form. Photoresin printing is a chemical process. This process is not addressed by the MSDS.
Not sure your point here is? So is any resin curing, as well as paint curing or woodstain working…
Hi Daniel,
Yes. There are resins and coatings that are real nasty. Obviously not all of them.
JP B
that wasnt my point, nor was it even in the direction I was talking about. My response to you was about things being a chemical reaction, not about how nasty they are. So again not sure where you are going with this?
Hi Daniel,
You were trying to draw an equivalency between other resin processes, similarly to the way you were trying to draw an equivalency with the SDS of acetone.
The SDS is not the whole story. There are resin processes which should not be allowed in the space.
Does anyone else think it might be time to chill out on this issue for a day, sleep on it and come back a little calmer? I’m abstaining from this vote because I don’t feel qualified enough to have a valid opinion but I feel like I can hear you guys shouting at each other over the ether.
-D
I brought up other MSDS, because thats what was used as a reason for voting no. so you bring up its not the full story… well then show more of the story… because as far as I can find the Resin printer put off far less toxicity than FDM printers which we have been using for years at the hive, and which you are even trying to have a vote for one right now. And acetone vapors are far worse than 405nm cured resin vapors by far which was my point on the MSDS sheets. Simply put Resin printers dont put out a vapor that needs more ventilation than we currently have/need for chemicals currently in the shop.
How about a “cat” meme to calm everyone down.
Cute Trash Panda, I mean cat.
Im sorry but in all my years of printing sla is way better and safer, pla and abs put toxic crap into the air, with resin all you have to worry about is the liquid. And acetone is nothing to worry about, we are no where near air tight , really all you need is common sense and latex gloves. Finally if were gonna complain about fumes in the air then we shouldnt be welding, staining, painting with about proper ventilation!!!
Joe Pomeroy
One last point, UC has 8 of these sla printers and college students deal with them is a school setting. Yes the resin is toxic TO BARE SKIN thats why they wear gloves and use wash stations and curing stations. Its perfectly safe if you use your head.
Joe Pomeroy
Joey, thanks that was the point I was trying to get across. You did alot better job than I did explaining it though.
which is it joey or joe? the email and signature difference is throwing me off.
I don’t think anyone is arguing that the risks are not manageable.
The arguments are:
- The vote does not adequately address the auxiliary equipment and materials required to do this safely. We would need to include:
- A vent fan, modifications to the existing venting to ensure safety with the laser, or documentation on what resins are acceptable without added ventilation
- The equipment and materials required to safely clean the parts (HDPE Tubs with sealing lids, gallons of IPA, A 5 Gallon waste IPA container, Nitrile gloves, siphon pump or funnel, etc.)
- appropriate workspace cover/liner to catch and contain resin spills/drips
- a UV exposure light to cure waste/spilled resin so it can be treated as common waste vs. HAZ waste1. The printer proposed does not have sufficient consumer base to have confidence in it’s quality, reliability, and ease of use.
- Now may not be the right time for this purchase. Waiting a year or two and saving up/preparing for a higher quality printer with greater capabilities may be the better approach. We have several open large purchases/projects right now that need to be closed out before committing resources to a project/purchase like this, as the space would need to be prepared, Wiki information would need to to be developed, certification requirements developed, and classes set up for certification.
Again, I think there are enough people who would support this type of 3D printer being made available, we just need to consider/address the above items and do it properly.
Thanks,
Kevin
Funny that ventilation keeps getting brought up but not discussed when a conversation was started about that exact subject. We dont need additional ventilation for a resin printer any more than the hive needs it as a whole. That should be it’s own conversation not one that’s only brought up as an excuse not to get something. we dont require documentation or anything special with fdm on abs for the hive’s ultimaker or anyone elses 3d printer. But we allow that to be printed even though its been proven to spit nasty chemicals in the air. Come on Kevin I’m sure you can see the double standard here…
So rubbing alcohol as well as a tray to catch spilled resin? I’ll personally provide a plastic mat and some alcohol to start even though Both Can be covered with the current vote… we already provide nitrile gloves at the hive and I’ll throw in a box of 50 more so…
And wait a year? For what another large vote to take its place? one of the worse excuses i hear is we have other large item votes out… what do we now have to say no to large project a because we want large project b more? That excuse just doesnt hold its weight when funds isnt the issue. Right now if we lost every member we’d have 2.5 years of Bills covered. Hell even if we got the form 3L today and every member left, the hive would still pay Bills for nearly 2 years. (Of course at that point we’d have noone to pay the bills, but that’s a different story.) we have over 30000 in the bank, with a current increase (before votes) of $1000 on average per month. $500 isnt going to effect our funds
Also:
HDPE containers: https://amzn.to/2HcsGTv this would be used to store resin, which isnt being provided by the hive, so not something the hive should be supplying.
Funnel/syphon… dollar tree, Kevin you mentioned donating toward a machine already, care to spare a dollar if we dont have it available in the vote? There is suppose to be a joking tone there, Seriously though… its a dollar, extra funding was allocated was specifically for this kinda thing.
UV exposure light? for post curing? to start thats as simple as putting them outside for a few hours. If we see a large use of a printer, then we could easily make a new vote for that. Which if we get a larger/better printer, we would need to get one anyways.
This piece of equipment is pretty dummy proof, doesnt really need a certification, at least one thats gonna make a bloody bit of difference. Learn to make the equivalent to a gcode for this, learn exposure rates which will changed based on resin, and hit print. I been to our certification classes, they dont teach that equivalent kinda thing. The CNC router cert would need to be extended 3 fold just over the different bits that can be used. The laser also would need extended double or so on what materials need what strengths… The Controls are simple, print, controls for Z up down and home, UV exposure on and off, thats about it. The printer i brought up has auto leveling so you dont even have to worry about that, even if we go for a different printer.