Woodshop Shaper?

So I’m wondering what people think about the current shaper table.

https://wiki.hive13.org/view/Rockwell_Shaper

Right now there seems to be little if any information on it, I can’t find a manual, and from what I can tell it’s largely unused. Further we have a router with a 1/2" collet, and at that point the functionality really overlaps significantly. We essentially have two of the same tool. This realization is a large part of the reason why you seldom see shapers new for sale, generally the router has replaced it.

Finally, it’s missing the two star handles that screw down the fence, which is why I’m assuming it’s unused, and unwanted, because it’s missing an essential piece of equipment. So we appear to have a duplicate tool that’s unused, and is taking up some valuable floor space.

Anybody feel strongly about this? Would it make more sense to undonate it, or put it on Craig’s list, and put the money into the Hive coffers? Am I totally missing something here?

If people do feel strongly about this I can look into getting replacement handles.

Router and Shaper are two different animals that can do the same job. The shaper has advantages of larger motor, more power, and (generally) a sturdier fence. Shapers are usually for industrial or mill work (moldings etc) but as you pointed out, a router with 1/2 collet can duplicate much of the work. Between a bench and the router - undonating it might be a good idea, but as we just recently acquired it - it might be better form to offer it back to its original owner.

Yeah, I’ve done some more digging since this post. There are shapers out there with features that make them more distinct, automatic feed being the big one IMHO, but this one isn’t that. I also don’t see us doing a lot of molding. It might be usual for my door project, if I can get it to accept the router bit. I might bring it up at the next meeting, see if anybody has any good reasons to hold onto it.

As for recently acquired, you and I have different definitions of two years ago. :wink: Is there a way to get a hold of David Lear?

I understood it was sooner than that. Many apologies. Let’s Upcycle that thing to make room for a bench, lathe etc!

No worries, I’m just going by what’s on the wiki, could be wrong.

I’m down at the hive and did a bit more checking on this. First, it appears to be working, which is a plus, and I found the little wing nuts to hold down the fence.

The bad news is that it can only take a max of a 1/4" chuck, and there is no way to get it to take 1/2". The router bit I’d want to use in it is 1/2" as are most of the other serious profile cutters. Even if it fit, did it’s questionable if it would be a good idea or not, just due to the differences in speeds as you mentioned. Further it doesn’t seem like there’s a huge line of people anxious to use the real router + table we do have, so a back up less router seems less than useful.

There also seem to be some other profile cutters in a bag in the base, which is where I found the wing nuts. However, I’m dubious if we could get any others, since it’s so old. Could be easy, could be a pain.

Anyway, I’m going to bring it up at the next meeting, upcycling seems like the best approach.

I’d be interested in learning how to use it. We need to make new trim for our house to match existing trim (removed old trim upstairs due to lead hazards). If that is something that we can do on the router or shaper? I know it costs about 60$ to get a profile knife cut usually. Just wondering. We also might just say screw it, the stuff upstairs doesn’t have to match the downstairs. Depends alot on costs.

Thanks,
Tiffany

Yeah but without the auto feed, the router with a 1/2" is the better way to make your moulding. Or have paxton make it. 300ft and they wave setup.

http://bid.bidfta.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?edwinmoses235/EM046756

http://bid.bidfta.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?edwinmoses235/EM046770

of any interest for these??

I’d be interested in learning how to use it. We need to make new trim for our house to match existing trim (removed old trim upstairs due to lead hazards). If that is something that we can do on the router or shaper?

Well, let me be a bit clearer on what we’re discussing. In BOTH cases there is a round bit spun by a motor at high speeds. BOTH will cut a profile, so you start to get into questions of which profile do you want cut. I just ran the router through this profile, and it’s far more complex than most stuff people are going to want to do, so I think we can do without the shaper we currently have.

http://www.freudtools.com/index.php/products/product/99-269

Now there are a couple of pluses to our shaper over our router, mostly that it has a nicer table and guard. But those are easier but improving the router table than it is to fix the problems with the current shaper.

I know it costs about 60$ to get a profile knife cut usually. Just wondering. We also might just say screw it, the stuff upstairs doesn’t have to match the downstairs. Depends alot on costs.

You also might find it’s a lot of trouble to run your own trim.

http://bid.bidfta.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?edwinmoses235/EM046756

The lathe seems excellent. The downside is that it’s short, and would require an additional extension, which is coming in at $130 right now.

https://www.amazon.com/Delta-Industrial-46-463-Midi-Lathe-Extension/dp/B0030MMB2A/ref=pd_sim_469_4?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B0030MMB2A&pd_rd_r=2JYMJ4VPPJET6BMTXX1A&pd_rd_w=kNd3A&pd_rd_wg=W2689&psc=1&refRID=2JYMJ4VPPJET6BMTXX1A

http://bid.bidfta.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?edwinmoses235/EM046770

Lots of bad reviews on Amazon, and it’s not an improvement over the Craftsman jointer or the Delta thickness planer we already own. The Craftman’s only draw back the the lack of a helical cutter, but the Jet doesn’t have one either. The Craft’sman has three knives to the 2 on the Jet. Finally the table itself is what a lot of people were complaining about, and from what I can tell our jointer table is excellent.

It’s also not as good as our current thickness planer, which will accept 12" boards vs the 10" this one supports.

I’m going to go with a no on that one.

BTW, this drill press would be a huge improvement over what we currently have. However, I wouldn’t bid much more than ~500, and it’s likely to close at 600-700.

http://bid.bidfta.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?edwinmoses235/EM046625

is this wood lathe something we should consider then?

Yes. If anything the extension is a bonus because it makes it easier to store when not in use, something I think we need to start considering with the tools in the woodshop.

how much would you spend on one (including tax)?

A lathe might not be a bad investment (I’m biased though…) however I don’t believe that delta is much (if at all) better than our current lathe. If we were looking at another lathe - something with a swing out head and/or actual variable speed would be the move forward. Tools for them would be nice too. I have my BB’s but the hive has none.

Unrelated - do we have any brass setup spacers for the router/tablesaw ?

A lathe might not be a bad investment (I’m biased though…) however I don’t believe that delta is much (if at all) better than our current lathe.

I disagree. The delta can expand to 68", with 2x $130 extensions, which makes it more than long enough, and a 1 hp variable speed motor. (1 expansion would be enough to make table legs, not sure what projects would require 68") The expansions are nicer than a lathe that’s all one piece because it will be easier to store when not in use. I believe the current lathe is similar size, but far more limited. I can’t seem to find it in the tool list in the wiki, so I’m not even sure who it belongs too.

If we were looking at another lathe - something with a swing out head and/or actual variable speed would be the move forward.

Not sure I understand, the Delta has a variable speed motor.

Tools for them would be nice too. I have my BB’s but the hive has none.

They would be nice, but I think I’d get my own. Anything that needs to be sharpened correctly I feel better about having for my own use. This includes hand planes, chisels, and other small tools. Plus they’re relatively inexpensive.

Unrelated - do we have any brass setup spacers for the router/tablesaw ?

I’m not sure what you’re asking about, but I don’t believe I’ve seen anything that would fit that bill.

Not sure I understand, the Delta has a variable speed motor.

I looked at the wrong model for specs - my bad. Outboard turning for larger projects is nice but not necessary. That Delta is one of their nicer ones (pretty comparable to the Jet I used to own) and about 1/2 price of new from amazon and looks to be NIB. - but a look over the internet and Amazon says they have a history of bad control boards - something to watch for.

They would be nice, but I think I’d get my own. Anything that needs to be sharpened correctly I feel better about having for my own use. This includes hand planes, chisels, and other small tools. Plus they’re relatively inexpensive.

Agreed. Sharp and sometimes pointy things should be personal. Maybe we can convince the warden to invest in a sharpening system for the Hive though?

Setup bars - brass - milled to something ridiculous like +/-.0002 of the marked measurement and won’t damage carbide bits,blades, teeth etc. Very handy for setup of exact measured cuts on anything with a fence. Usually cheap ~$20.00

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I know it costs about 60$ to get a profile knife cut usually. Just wondering. We also might just say screw it, the stuff upstairs doesn’t have to match the downstairs. Depends alot on costs.

Andrew wrote - You also might find it’s a lot of trouble to run your own trim.

Agree with Andrew - I were doing trim - I’d NOT want to run it on a router or a shaper especially without an auto feed. Seriously talk to Paxton Lumber. After 300lf they usually waive setup fees (unless your wood needs carbide) and they do it for a living. .http://www.paxtonwood.com/Profiles.aspx

image.png

Not sure I understand, the Delta has a variable speed motor.

I looked at the wrong model for specs - my bad. Outboard turning for larger projects is nice but not necessary. That Delta is one of their nicer ones (pretty comparable to the Jet I used to own) and about 1/2 price of new from amazon and looks to be NIB. - but a look over the internet and Amazon says they have a history of bad control boards - something to watch for.

Interesting. I keep forgetting they have control boards in everything. Maybe I should keep my dad’s old Craftsman stuff, you flip a switch, it runs. When it don’t run, it means the angry pixies have a line disconnected. Hate to sound like a luddite, but it just seems like a simplier design.

Agreed. Sharp and sometimes pointy things should be personal. Maybe we can convince the warden to invest in a sharpening system for the Hive though?

Could be. Honestly I bought some water stones for my chisels, and I’ve got a set of paper disks for my knives, so I’ve got mine. ;D Wouldn’t oppose anybody else looking to get some, but it’s not a priority for me.

Setup bars - brass - milled to something ridiculous like +/-.0002 of the marked measurement and won’t damage carbide bits,blades, teeth etc. Very handy for setup of exact measured cuts on anything with a fence. Usually cheap ~$20.00

There is definitely NOT a nice set under the mill in a red box. No sir!