Proposal - $1,000 for upgraded dust collection in woodshop.

This is a formal proposal for a vote as a follow up for the previous RFC.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/cincihackerspace/Mm6gc8MaFY4

I don’t believe the goals have shifted much from the previous post, other than the addition of two new fine dust filters, one as a replacement, and the other as a backup.

I vote Yes.

Bump

Not to be an overly pedantic pecker head, but can you go over what the actual proposal is at this point in time? I have no problems with blanket requests for small stuff, i.e. Brad’s request for a bunch of bolts, but at this price tag I’d like a better idea of what I’m thumbs upping or downing. The original post did list a number of things, but then over the next week and a half, some of those things showed up, got multiple suggestions, or potentially became non-issues because of other maintenance.

Additionally we are preparing to expand into the hallway space, will there be any changes to the layout of the tools in the woodshop with that expansion? One of the proposals was hard line installation for the dust collection. As well, will be able to fund both the woodshop improvements and the buildout in the new space at the same time?

So as I’m typing this up and the more I’m thinking about the big picture of stuff at the space, I will likely not be voting in favor of a big ticket overhaul in the woodshop at this time, but that doesn’t mean I’m against the project. If there is a clear proposal that would at least make me feel like I’m voicing an informed opinion.

Will

Not to be an overly pedantic pecker head, but can you go over what the actual proposal is at this point in time?

Things I’d like to hook up:

  1. Jointer - Might just end up with a better box
  2. Thickness Planer
  3. Spindle Sander
  4. Router Table
  5. Dust collection for Drill Press/Lathe.

Upgrades:

  1. No indicators
    a) I’d like to build two boxes, one for each output, both with see through sides, so that people would know when it was time to empty them. Further the large dust collection would be more efficient space wise as a flat box, up against the central pillar. I’d like both boxes to be designed such that they could be easily disconnected and dumped into the trash bin. Running the shop vacs into ports appears to have cause problems with the small dust collection.
    b) I’d like to build a manometer to determine if we’re getting enough air flow through. I’ve got parts for this partially from Steve Jones. Current plan is to have a light turn on when there are problems.
  2. Too much flexitube - Flexitube is less efficient than metal duct work, resulting in poor performance.
    a) Band Saw - Could probably be mostly redone in metal tubing. Route is a bit wonky. Also needs a different splitter, current top hose has little suction
    b) CNC Router - Could probably have it’s flexitube shortened a few feet, not a big deal. Also needs to have the split going to the 2nd CNC removed.
    c) Large saggy flex tube feed into the small dust collector - should be mostly replaced with metal ducting.
    d) Similar problem with the large dust collection

On going maintence:
I’d like to buy two large filters for fine dust removal. These are ~$300 for two (around 100-120 each)

Additionally we are preparing to expand into the hallway space, will there be any changes to the layout of the tools in the woodshop with that expansion?

I don’t think so, no.

As well, will be able to fund both the woodshop improvements and the buildout in the new space at the same time?

I don’t think I can answer that without knowing what the plan is for the other space. I’ve heard it’s going to be the new meeting space, which would require us to just move some tables.

So as I’m typing this up and the more I’m thinking about the big picture of stuff at the space, I will likely not be voting in favor of a big ticket overhaul in the woodshop at this time, but that doesn’t mean I’m against the project. If there is a clear proposal that would at least make me feel like I’m voicing an informed opinion.

Sorry, thought I was being clear. None of the stuff from the original proposal has changed all that much, IMHO. We should also have a final configuration of the woodshop after the meeting tonight. I don’t think this is going to get voted on until next week. I think I can provide better estimates after that configuration, but I don’t see things changing that radically.

Oh, and I’d also like to make further improvements to the radial arm saw, and hook up the miter saw as well.

So a quick update on the plan for dust collection improvement. Greg and I (and a several other helpful people) rearranged the woodshop to what we feel is close to a final configuration.

The band saw (unmoved), spindle sander (unmoved), and router are clustered around the large pole. We plan to have 4 connections and 4 blast gates here. One connection for each tool, and a “sweeper” attachment for cleaning the tops of tools. Those connections will feed from a 6" duct off a new connection, which will probably be the capped connection that was going to service the table saw. The current wye to the band saw will be removed.

Drill Press and Lathe are now in the corner formerly occupied by the medium CNC and lumber rack. Currently the 4" connection that serviced the old medium CNC can be used to sweep these, but the plan is for replacing a lot of the flexible hose with metal pipe (better performance) and making the 4" hose easier to use as a sweeper attachment, so that people can use dust collection to sweep off these two machine.

The thickness planer will continue to live under the bench for now. Greg feels there isn’t enough interest/use to justify making a permanent home for it. I personally disagree, but I see his point, and I’m will to put off building it a stand for now. We might end up with a stand that can be put away under the bench.

The jointer will get a nicer box with a better chute to keep things from escaping, but currently there are no plans to attach it to dust collection.

The large CNC will continue to work as it currently does. There’s been some suggestion of moving it to it’s own cyclone, which I’m not in favor of doing. First, cyclones + shop vacs are inferior performance wise to the larger cyclone we’ve got. The large cyclone also doesn’t require new bags (or filters) as often as shop vacs. Second, I don’t think it will address problems with people not cleaning it out.

We have decided to punt on blowing the dust out the window for now. The issue is that people are not comfortable where the dust might do. From what I can tell this isn’t an issue, but caution seems the best approach for now. This means we’ll be buying two large filters, which will add $300 to the project.

Finally as per the original plan I’m going to be making at least one transparent box so that it’s clearly visible that the dust collection system needs to be cleaned. It won’t fix problems with people being too lazy to clean it, but it should be clearer. For example it’s pretty clear that somebody filled the 55 gallon drum sometime between Monday and the Tuesday meeting and didn’t bother to take it out.

We’ll also be going ahead with a manometer, which will be attached to the fine dust collection, and will indicate when we need to clean/replace the filters.

Expect a follow up plan with estimations of materials and cost in a day or two once I’ve had a chance to do a bit more research.

Breakout of materials and costs.

Materials List for Dust Collection Upgrade

Router/Band Saw/Spindle Sander location
3x 6" 5’ straight sections @ $15 = $45
2x 6" 45 deg elbows @ $10 = $20
4x 6" wye’s @ $15 = $60
4x 6" Blast Gates @ $25 = $100
Sub Total: $225

Router
Tool adapter kit @$15

Spindle Sander
6" to 4" reducer @$10
4" wye @ $15
2x 4" to 2 1/2" reducer @ $10 = $20
Sub Total: $45

Sweeper attachment
6" to 4" reducer @$10

Lathe/Drill Press Sweeper
4x 4" 5’ straight sections @ $15 = $60
2x 4" 45 degree elbows @ $10 = $20
Sweeping attachment handle @ $30
Sub Total: $110

Radial Arm Saw
6" Wye @ $15
DIY Sheet metal dust collector materials @ $50
Sub Total: $65

Cyclone Dust collection boxes
4x8 Sheet of 1/2 plywood @ $40
8x clasps @ $5 = $40
Weatherstripping @ $10
Sub Total: $90

Total for new ducting: $560

Cyclone Filters
2x Fine Dust Filters @ $150 = $300

We have decided against this, but if anybody is interested in the costs of a hardline out the window for fine dust, it’s about $70. We’d need about 20’ of 6" ducting, and a vent.

tl;dr: Ducting is about $550, and then another $300 for new filters. This leaves $150 in wiggle room for unexpected problems, or changes in plans.

I have some metal HVAC ducting I’m not using. 6" I think. I’ll bring it in and leave it in the woodshop for you.
-D

Perfect! Thanks Dave! If you could, please place it at the top of the pallets next to the table saw, there’s where the other remains are currently being stored.

Bump. Also, since I can’t make it tonight, I vote “Yes”.

Yes.



From: Andrew
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 5:56 PM
To: Hive13 Hackerspace
Reply To: cincihackerspace@googlegroups.com
Subject: [CHP] Re: Proposal - $1,000 for upgraded dust collection in woodshop.

Bump. Also, since I can’t make it tonight, I vote “Yes”.

I vote yes

I vote yes

Brad

Mike and I vote yes

Yes from katie and I

Come on, gang. No voting accepted after the meeting. :smiley:

It’s moot point in this case. The vote passed.

Andrew/Greg

On a related note, have you seen simple control systems in this style? We may be over complicating things by adding microcontrollers into the mix.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0006FKJEQ/

  • Ry

Ryan,
To be honest, I don’t have a problem with walking a few steps to turn on the dust collection system, so I don’t care either way if we add remotes. Regardless of whether they’re there or not, the first steps is likely to be go around the hive and close the other open gates.

Remotes would be great and if working with a large or heavy piece it would make it really nice. I’m with ya on not minding the stroll to the swith 95 percent of the time…but when that 5 percent time comes up thank you remote on/off

Sure, I can see your point. If somebody else wants to do it, I’m all in favor, but that’s not what I’m going to do with the $1K budget, as stated in the RFC.